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Fuel Tank Sender Unit


 
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Clive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006
Posts: 318
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 21:54    Post subject: Fuel Tank Sender Unit Reply with quote

Hi Guys

My Isuzu has developed a fuel leak which appears to be coming from the sender unit.

Is it possible to get the sender unit out and more importantly back in without bending the arm etc. in the process, without having to remove the fuel tank.

Can the plastic unit itself leak or will it more than likely be the seal between the unit and the tank, are they just a paper gasket or rubber, also is it possible to syphon the fuel out rather than undoing the drain plug and having a bath in diesel.



Cheers

Clive
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 21:54    Post subject: Google Ads keep this community free to join!


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C.B.
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Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 144
Location: Central Scotland

PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2015 19:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

Strangely enough I’m just back in from investigating a strong smell of petrol in our garage and came on here to look for some clues and I think I have found the same problem.

At the front top half of the tank on the drivers side there’s petrol along the ledge worst right below a circular metal part that sticks out from the tank, I’m guessing that’s the sender unit Question    Really difficult to get my head up high enough to see what’s going on but when I feel round it there seems to be some gummy soft plastic bulging out the edge of the circular plate, but maybe that’s just gunk from the dissolved insulation from round the wiring that goes to the connector sticking out of that plate.  Now I wish I hadn’t filled it to the brim at the weekend. Sad



I’m kind of worried as the place stinks of petrol – just as well I stopped smoking last year!!
So, I guess I have similar questions to Clive’s as I’m not sure where to start with this.
I also wondered (thinking worse case) if the tank for the 3.5 Petrol is different from 3.0 diesel 'cause if it is it's liable to be Isuzu ££££s part only.
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'00 3.5i V6 SWB Trooper (18 MPG Embarassed Sad )
'02 SAAB 95T Aero (F.A.F.  Cool )
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Clive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006
Posts: 318
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2015 21:55    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi CB

That’s mine to a tee, fuel running along the ledge and gummy soft plastic bulging out from the edge of the circular plate, only difference is mines diesel not petrol.

I am hoping I can get the screws out of the circular plate, and also have enough room to pull the unit out of the tank including the float arm without it fouling on anything else under the car.

I’ve just had another look at my tank and there is no drain plug, strangely enough I’ve done the same as you and filled the tank to the brim as I was going to do a bit of check to find out what it was doing to the gallon these days.

I’ve read the article on here about removing the tank and the guy had to grind the screw heads off in order to remove the circular plate, but then he was fitting a new tank so wouldn’t need to get the remaining part of the threads out.

My tank was new eight years ago although I didn’t fit it myself, needless to say I don’t want to buy another new one already.
The trouble with some screws is the fact they screw into a caged nut, if the cage rips off the inside that’ll be the end of the tank so I'm just hoping they aren't made that way.
I’d say apply some heat on them but given what’s been in the tanks that’s a definite NO NO.

I don’t know how far you’ve got with yours but I even had a problem getting the screws out which hold the big tank cover in place.
I managed to get them out on the passenger side, but on the driver side, one the head sheared clean off and the other I had to hacksaw off, then try and re-drill and tap them working upside down, needless to say that turned out to be another swine of a job.
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KeithB1
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Location: N.Wales

PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2015 8:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a leak from the sender unit on mine, there was a small crack in the plastic. I took the sender out of the tank and covered it in sealant and it hasn't leaked since. This was done with the tank off the car though.
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Clive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006
Posts: 318
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2015 17:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi keith

Thanks for your feedback, when you say you covered it with sealant are we talking covering the inside, outside or both.
I thought why go to that trouble until I phoned a main agent for a price, I just can’t believe how they arrive at their figures.
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C.B.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 2:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't get very far with mine, feeling around the sender with my fingers appears to have made it leak worse.
There's no way the screws would come out from the sender unit, too much corrosion on the heads and the metal flange, pity about that 'cause I reckon it could come out tank in situ and get a new seal fitted (seeing as the sender is working fine).
The drain plug is stuck fast so I tried to syphon the petrol out to find it must have an anti-syphon gizmo fitted, so it's still almost full and now out the garage and parked up on a hilly bit at the side of the house.
Dealer will not change the sender (part £96.63 including chancellors cut) without removing the tank first, which is ~3 hours labour and of course there is a high risk of damage to any corroded bits on the 15 year old tank.
The petrol version tank is different from the diesel tank so there's no aftermarket option and there's no Isuzu ones available in the UK (£332.74) - could take up to 60 days to get one from overseas and that would be firm sale order only. So if they haul it out and find they need a new tank, it's sat there for 2 months just when we really need the 4WD.

So all in all not a good day.  My thinking now is to run about in short runs until the tank is almost empty then keep it on the road with between 5 and 15 litres, order up the bits including the tank and change the whole lot in one morning when it arrives and make things safe again.

Seems strange that the seal appears to have swollen up and gone all gummy and misshaped, makes me wonder if there's an issue there with the material.  Reminds me of a Samsung phone I used to have in the house, the rubbery plastic earpiece socket cover suddenly decided it would revert back to semi-liquid state and made a right sticky mess. Mad

Have you managed to drop your tank out yet Clive?
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'00 3.5i V6 SWB Trooper (18 MPG Embarassed Sad )
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Clive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006
Posts: 318
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 18:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Keith

No I haven’t dropped my tank yet I was waiting for you to do yours so you could tell me all the pitfalls.
Nah only joking my friend  Laughing , but I don’t fancy driving it around with diesel trailing out of it, as a matter of fact there is a trail of marks where the diesel drip onto the public sidewalk outside my house, I’ve tried to wash it off to no avail, guess I’ll have to let the foot traffic and mother nature get rid of it, plus call me a scared cat if you like but I’m a bit worried about diesel leaking onto the wires of the sender unit and causing a short, I don’t want Guy Fawkes Night prematurely.

No, the master plan was to go for a drive this weekend in my other car which is also a diesel but that’s also full at the moment and then syphon out of the Trooper into the other car, otherwise I’ve no containers to accommodate that amount of fuel.

I’ve just tried to get a plastic tube down the filler pipe of the Trooper but it doesn’t want to go into the tank.
It could be the same as yours and have an anti-syphon baffle in it or it maybe bottoming where the filler pipe turns at ninety degrees to go towards the fuel tank, very much like it’s shown in the picture you posted.

If I can’t get the tube in I will have to drop the tank full of fuel !!Nice!!.
Instead of using house bricks I thought maybe use the trolley jack with a wooden batten attached to it so it can be lowered just enough to disconnect any pipework on top of the tank as I’m unsure if it could come all the way down with them still connected.

My tank holds 85 litres so not something I’d want to balance on my chest (4.546 Litres of diesel weights 3.8677kg so total weight 72.317kg (159.43lbs) that’s not including the tank itself.

This is just a thought but in the engine bay of my Trooper there’s a priming pump (see page 6C-6 onwards in the manual), if I can disconnect the fuel line which comes from the tank at that point and fit a small syphon pump to the pipe Iv'e pull off, maybe I could syphon the diesel from the front of the car, saves having to drop a full tank or struggling to try and get the syphon tube past the bend in the filler pipe if that’s what’s stopping it.

As far as your car is concerned maybe you could break into the delivery pipe line in the engine bay always of course providing you don’t have to dismantle half the car to do it, I know what an absolute nightmare some of these jobs can turn out to be.

No doubt you are already aware if you want to remove the tank with the filler pipe attached, then the wheel arch spat will need to be removed, mine was held on with some little plastic screws although the anchorage brackets were metal and just crumbled away to bits so I had to make some new ones and pop rivet them on, I did this when I under-sealed it a few months ago.

As far as fuel tanks go I paid £218.55 including vat for mine back in October 2006, the place was called www.fueltanksdirect.co.uk but an quick check I don’t think they do them for petrol, heaven knows why or you could try www.bestpartstore.co.uk, it's a uk website but they are based in Germany, I had a fuel injector from them which would otherwise cost me £350 just for the one.

Let me know how you get on.
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Grandad
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Joined: 22 Sep 2005
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Location: NORFOLK

PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 20:37    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tip !!!! to remove fuel from any vehicle with out mess get some containers or another vehicle to put fuel in
take an external electronic fuel pump off an old car I have one off an audi connect with tubing to the incoming pipe on the fuel filter run the outlet tube into container or other car pump will run off 12 volts and away you go
will take a bit of messing about to get right size tubing but makes job so easy
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Rhanagar
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Location: Preston, Lancs.

PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 22:32    Post subject: Reply with quote

That Grandad ... "smarter than the average bear Yogi!" Very Happy
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Clive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006
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Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 23:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the tip Grandad, I guess my idea would work syphoning from the priming pump provided of course whatever I was syphoning  into was lower than the tank I'm syphoning from, but all credit to you no doubt an electric pump will do it a lot faster and uphill if necessary.,

Well at least I won't have to rely on gravity so much, just need to find a cheapo pump, Ho and go for that drive in the other car.
Well it beats working on them  Laughing      

Cheers
Clive
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Grandad
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 24, 2015 16:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

No praise please we're british Embarassed
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Wilky
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Location: West Yorkshire

PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 20:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a diesel leak from my sender unit, thought it was just the gasket, but turned out it was the plastic faceplate of the sender unit, there was a slight crack in it, so I Araldited the plastic faceplate to the metal cover, allowed it to set, fit a new gasket and it's been fine for over four years. I did it with the tank in situ on the car, fidgety, but easily doable. One thing to be aware of is that the five small screws are not equally spaced, they look as though they are but one is slightly different to make sure it goes back in the correct orientation.
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KeithB1
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 5:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Clive,

Sorry for the late reply, been a bit busy with work, I sealed the outside of the plastic underneath the metal cover.
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C.B.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 2:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clive, I made some progress but have now given up on the DIY and I’m waiting on a new tank being delivered to the dealer so they can replace the leaky sender unit...

Finally with the help of a long lever and some force I got the drain plug to lift and took out most of the petrol, stinky messy job but it stopped the leaking.   After a bit of release oil and carefully cleaning up the heads of the 4 bolts for the steel cover I finally got them out and dropped the cover, washed it in solvent, grinded/sanded it clean and gave it 2 coats of hammerite. Then having soaked and wire-brushed the 6 tank bolts for a couple of days I had a go at them again but no success, similar with the 5 screws for the sender unit itself.  Even with safety glasses I somehow ended up with oxide eyes at every attempt.    Crying or Very sad

Had it through at the dealers last week, they checked the tank pipes etc. with a mirror and reckoned it was too risky to drop the tank to get to the sender without having a new tank ready. So… I have ordered a new tank, sender and all the gaskets etc. and the dealer is going to do the changeover when the tank finally arrives on a boat from Thailand.  At least for now it’s still on the road.

I’m going to hand the dealer a set of Stainless bolts/nuts etc. to put in instead of the recycled Lancia ones they will offer, so thanks for the info on the screw size.  Smile
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