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Typical 3.0 trooper injector problems


 
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Pete68
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Joined: 11 Nov 2015
Posts: 22
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 15:34    Post subject: Typical 3.0 trooper injector problems Reply with quote

Hi can anyone help please!
I have a 52 plate SWB 3.0 trooper, recently whilst driving from Italy to the UK the engine over ran in Germany (thats a nightmare story for another time!) anyway had to leave the car and then recover back home to Italy. I had all 4 injectors reconditioned and then I fitted with new copper seals, new o-ring seals, new sleeve seals and new oil (5W30 fully synthetic) etc etc. Anyway the car starts and runs but is smoking (white/light grey smoke) and has no power - does anyone have any ideas why????
Thanks
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Rhanagar
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 16:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

They overun when the diesel in the oil ruins and leaks past the seals in the turbo. Either you still have crud in the exhaust or the seals are gone in the turbo.

That would be my guess.
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1990 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.I 2.8TD Manual Lotus Edition
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto Lotus Edition

Deceased
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto LS

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Pete68
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 16:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, thank you for the reply, can you explain any more than that? I am at a loss, this has cost me a fortune and i am gutted that it has made no difference i don't know what else to do.
Do the turbo seals normally go when an injector goes?
Thanks
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Rhanagar
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 17:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not an expert on the 3.0, however it is a well documented issue.

The sleeve seals on older vehicles allowed diesel to seep past into the oil gallery on the common rail. First sign is the oil level rising on the dipstick as the diesel fills the sump up. The diesel then thins the oil down. As the engine runs it circulates the oil around the turbo housing to lubricate it. When you get a mixture of diesel and oil the thinner oil seeps past the seals in the turbo. It also ruins them at the same time. Diesel is nasty stuff like that. Eventually you get a situation where the hot diesel/oil mixture has broken the turbo seals enough that the mixture is blasted through the inlet system of the engine in enough of a quantity that it causes the engine to overrun i.e. regardless of what the injectors are doing there is now enough diesel/oil/air being forced into the engine by the turbo that it can run regardless. This then produces exhaust fumes which spin the turbo, which in turn pushes more diesel/oil/air into the engine. so on and so on.

Now if you have had the seals and injectors replaced (which are a warranty item if not done already) then the turbo seals could well be shot. This means that it will be pulling oil past them and into the inlet system. This then produces smoke out the back. There is minimal risk of overrun now though as there is no diesel present, however it has been known for the seals to fail again unless you use genuine Isuzu seals and copper washers. They are a very specific tolerance.

As said I am no expert on these engines. Hopefully someone more clued up like Eithan or Gribble will pop in and confirm. They might even have another option as to the cause of your latest symptoms.
_________________
1990 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.I 2.8TD Manual Lotus Edition
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto Lotus Edition

Deceased
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto LS

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Pete68
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Joined: 11 Nov 2015
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Location: Italy

PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 17:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

Once again many thanks for the explanation it kinda makes sense !!!! if this is the case then !! There will be more oil than normal in the intercooler radiator hose and in the turbo connecting pipe to the air cleaner ??
And again if this is the case how easy (difficult) is it to replace the turbo seals ?? can they be changed ? many many many kind regards at a loss pete
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Rhanagar
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 17:52    Post subject: Reply with quote

You shouldn't see anything between the filter and front of the turbo. However you will see an "amount" of oil between the turbo and inlet manifold. Usually it is really apparent in the intercooler. Also if it has been left for a while and you pull the pipe off the front of the turbo you will see oil running out the front. The amount is purely based on how bad things are.

Unfortunately replacing the turbo seals isn't an option due to the way the turbo is made. Best course of action is to replace the turbo with either new or known good second hand.

As said I "think" this is your issue. I could be wrong.
_________________
1990 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.I 2.8TD Manual Lotus Edition
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto Lotus Edition

Deceased
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto LS

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Pete68
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 17:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks for the reply, I will have to wait and see if anyone else has any ideas, i cant afford to replace the turbo.
Thanks again Pete
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eithan h
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Location: oxfordish

PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 19:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

What does it start like? Do you know if they used genuine seals?
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Pete68
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 19:20    Post subject: Reply with quote

hello
Ok well it starts on the button, it seems to idle fine, on the first start up after the work was done it really smoked then it cleared a little got it up to temp then turned it off.
started again from cool, again started on the button this time on idle hardly any smoke but on acceleration zero power and the smoke is back !!!!!
and all the seals were genuine isuzu ???? any help would be greatly appreciated Pete
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eithan h
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 19:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

Black smoke means either to much fuel or not enough air, if you remove the intake pipe to the turbo does the impeller turn?
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Pete68
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Joined: 11 Nov 2015
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Location: Italy

PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 19:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

hello once again
its white smoke !!! borderline light grey,
ill check the impeller tomorrow i didnt check earlier as i was close to completely throwing in the towel, these really are problematic motors arnt they ?????
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Gribble
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 19:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd  be interested to know what was in involved in the reconditioning of the injectors as not many paces can do them or test them after .
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Pete68
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 19:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi there
It took some finding i can tell you but swadlincote diesel services did the testing and the recon work cost a fortune too but they looked the part !!!!! not that this is helping me now ???.
do you have any input on the issues im having or is this going to be another 3.0 ltr horror story,
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