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53 Plate 3.0 Trooper Duty Starting Issues


 
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2droothy
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Joined: 23 Feb 2016
Posts: 7
Location: Ayrshire

PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2019 15:33    Post subject: 53 Plate 3.0 Trooper Duty Starting Issues Reply with quote

Hi there.
What a helpful informative forum this is!
I have owned my Trooper for three years now. It has always had intermittent starting issues but so far hasn't let me down. It cut out on me recently when slowing down for a stop sign. I took it to my mechanic who stuck it on the diagnostics and there were no error codes evident. He found a perished vacuum pipe which I changed and the car started better. I recently changed the short ones (EGR valve?) as some of them were perished and cracked. I still have intermittent starting issues and since I use the vehicle for launching and recovering my boat from beaches, it needs to start reliably. I fear that I might have a fuel issue and I was hoping that someone might post a step by step way of checking the fuel delivery. Would a blocked open EGR valve cause this? When the engine has warmed up it starts on the button, it's only when it is cold after an overnight stop or even when I return to it after 5-6 hours out fishing. When it does start it doesn't accelerate and has to be coaxed to get the revs up. Once it does accelerate it runs fine and can be driven ok. It has 169,000 miles and pulls the boat well.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2019 15:33    Post subject: Google Ads keep this community free to join!


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wildata
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Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 104
Location: Ireland

PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi 2Droothy,
There are a myriad of causes for poor starting.
But yours occurs when cold, improves when warm,
and causes a full cut out.
Look up;
Oil Pick Up pipe.
High pressure oil pipe.
Sump Strainer - posts on this forum.

Without being very technical - a small pipe in the bottom of the engine can crack or break causing these symptoms.
The test is to make sure the oil is up to the mark,
and THEN overfill by 2 litres.
This brings the oil level over the part that cracks
If this cures these symptoms, after you drive it carefully and slowly for a few days to check (note you must not leave the extra 2 litres in long term NOR must you rev the engine over 2500 rpm or use the car on unlevel ground while it is overfilled) then you need your mechanic to remove the sump pan and weld the cracked part.
Not a big job for a good mechanic - but he needs to be able to weld and note there is no gasket needed just sealant. 2 - 3 hours.
If overfilling does not "cure" the issue you still need to correct the oil level.
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2droothy
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Joined: 23 Feb 2016
Posts: 7
Location: Ayrshire

PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

wildata wrote:
Hi 2Droothy,
There are a myriad of causes for poor starting.
But yours occurs when cold, improves when warm,
and causes a full cut out.
Look up;
Oil Pick Up pipe.
High pressure oil pipe.
Sump Strainer - posts on this forum.

Without being very technical - a small pipe in the bottom of the engine can crack or break causing these symptoms.
The test is to make sure the oil is up to the mark,
and THEN overfill by 2 litres.
This brings the oil level over the part that cracks
If this cures these symptoms, after you drive it carefully and slowly for a few days to check (note you must not leave the extra 2 litres in long term NOR must you rev the engine over 2500 rpm or use the car on unlevel ground while it is overfilled) then you need your mechanic to remove the sump pan and weld the cracked part.
Not a big job for a good mechanic - but he needs to be able to weld and note there is no gasket needed just sealant. 2 - 3 hours.
If overfilling does not "cure" the issue you still need to correct the oil level.


Thanks very much for your prompt reply wildata. Lots of great hints there for me to follow up!
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eithan h
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Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Posts: 8195
Location: oxfordish

PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 19:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

search the white wire trick and see if it gives any improvement
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2droothy
Newbie


Joined: 23 Feb 2016
Posts: 7
Location: Ayrshire

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 16:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi again.
Thanks for the heads up about the starting issues.
I couldn't find any specific reference to the "white wire trick" in the forum seach engine.
I had some engine oil to top up to +2 litres but decided against it, preferring to take it to my mechanic and let him do it and eventually drain the surplus.
I went to start the trooper but although it turned over very sprightly for a long time, it didn't even fire or misfire.
I have home service with Green Flag (only until 06/08/2019 because they upped my premium by £30 from last year), so I called them out.
The guy sprayed "Sure Start" into the air intake and it started strongly first turn!!!
I'm now in possession of two cans of this miracle mixture Rolling Eyes
Thanks again for your prompt replies. I hope I don't need any more counselling for a while Wink
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eithan h
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Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Posts: 8195
Location: oxfordish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 16:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

Be careful with that sort of stuff as engines get addicted to it and then won’t start without it
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2droothy
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Joined: 23 Feb 2016
Posts: 7
Location: Ayrshire

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 20:05    Post subject: Reply with quote

eithan h wrote:
Be careful with that sort of stuff as engines get addicted to it and then won’t start without it


I heard that from someone else too.
What problem would the sure start override?
There was no smoke so the glow plugs are ok, the oil pressure must be ok too or it would probably have cut out. The fuel must have been in the head.
I was gobsmacked when it started spontaneously...I can only think that the fuel delivery must have been helped by the ignition of the Sure Start.
Kinda weird, although I can remember my old man using a spray on his diesel truck like 55 years ago and also seen it used on dumper trucks etc.....
Isn't it ether?
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eithan h
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Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Posts: 8195
Location: oxfordish

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 20:15    Post subject: Reply with quote

so the fact it ran means the cam and crank and timing are good so it's either oil pressure which needs about 3.5mpa to start it so could be leaking injector or seal on the gallery or the oil rail control valve is struggling or the hpop is struggling as well. or it could be the fuel system is leaking air in somewhere which on cranking is what the pump will suck rather than the diesel, when the spray is used it fires the engine which then sees revs of about 1000 instead of the 200 at cranking speed so can now overcome all of the above issues.
could still be the orps though so to do the white wire trick locate the injector plug by the dipstick tube and look for pin c it's stamped in to the plastic of the plug. remove this wire or cut it but leave enough to rejoin it and see if it starts, if it does then the orps is knackered and will need to be replaced
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