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injector tubes/sleeves

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gascony
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Joined: 02 Dec 2016
Posts: 10
Location: gers france

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 18:13    Post subject: injector tubes/sleeves Reply with quote

Hello to all, I'm a newbie and I'm not used to forums but here goes !

I've just been given a 1998 Trooper 3.0 D with the symptoms of the dreaded injector tube seals problem. It came here to France a long time ago and didn't get the recall upgrade. She's too good to scrap so i'm hoping to repair it.

Despite reading lots of posts/info on the subject here, I can't find exactly what I'm looking for. I also downloaded a workshop manual courtesy of a member ( sorry, can't remember who now) and can't see a mention of the part that is confusing me.

Having stripped it down, the injectors came out with not only the o ring in the groove but one further up loose around the shaft and all were damaged. In the cylinder head on top of each injector sleeve is a metal ring which is easily removed, i don't see what this does or how it marries up with the o ring and can't find a mention of it in the manual, can anybody throw some light on this ?  Now I realise you all give up your time to contribute and maybe one day I'll be able to as well,I suppose it depends how many things go wrong with it and how many I manage to fix !

Oh, and I 've a sleeve puller coming from Australia so assuming it works ok and I don't mess it up it will be here to borrow.

Cheers !
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eithan h
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Joined: 11 Dec 2005
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Location: oxfordish

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 20:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

that metal ring and the o ring directly under it are an old injector recall and are not used now so throw them away you only need the o ring in the groove about halfway up the injector.

only use genuine seals or give us a call and we can supply you with all the seals.
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gascony
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Joined: 02 Dec 2016
Posts: 10
Location: gers france

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 22:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow that was quick !
Thanks for your reply, that clears that up, I'll let you know if I need parts ,will know more when sleeves come out. We have a diesel specialist near by and i was going to go to him for the rings/seals as I'm guessing it's probably one of the major manufacturers that supplied OE ?
Thanks again
Cheers
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Rhanagar
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Joined: 12 Jan 2010
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Location: Preston, Lancs.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

People have used "other" rings and seals in the past and have had to do the job again. It seems for maximum reliability the ones direct from Isuzu (that Eithan will supply) are the way forward.
_________________
1990 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.I 2.8TD Manual Lotus Edition
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto Lotus Edition

Deceased
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto LS

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gascony
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Joined: 02 Dec 2016
Posts: 10
Location: gers france

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 16:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the reply, yes i can understand people have tried to save money by putting in O rings the same size and diameter but not the correct material. It's false economy .I always use oe spec parts on all my vehicles. I intended to get the parts locally here, as no postage etc to pay, but only if I could determine the material type/manufacturer ( I'm assuming Isuzu do not actually make them ). However i will certainly get them from Eithan if I can't be sure.
I'll let you know the outcome when the sleeves are out
Cheers
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Rhanagar
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Joined: 12 Jan 2010
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Location: Preston, Lancs.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 17:37    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isuzu still make them .. that is what Eithan will supply. Postage would be cheap as they will fit in a normal envelope Wink
_________________
1990 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.I 2.8TD Manual Lotus Edition
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto Lotus Edition

Deceased
1994 Isuzu Bighorn LWB Mk.II 3.1TD Auto LS

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gascony
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Joined: 02 Dec 2016
Posts: 10
Location: gers france

PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 12:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the puller arrived and although very nicely made, the external diameter of spacer tube was too small and went inside head and sat on the injector sleeve, so a quick modification of a piece of old waterpipe cleaned up and greased,same internal size but much thicker worked just fine.
I could see fluid down in the combustion chamber and after sucking it out, it appeared to be oil thinned with a hint of diesel !  So assume top seals/injector seal had gone ? They don't appear damaged but certainly flat.  I went to our local guy here and to his credit said he couldn't supply exact type as wouldn't be viton. So I'll contact Eithan, assume direct on his website ?

Just seen rhanagars sticky on oil specs and capacities,  very useful, good work .
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eithan h
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 12:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not in until Tuesday so give us a ring then and I'll sort it all out
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gascony
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Joined: 02 Dec 2016
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Location: gers france

PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 16:57    Post subject: failed repair? Reply with quote

I finally found time to replace the seals promptly supplied by Eithan. the job went well and despite being meticulous regarding cleanliness and lubricating seals it either appears not to have worked or I have another problem. I made sure both injectors and sleeves went back in where they came from with holes lined up and torqued down although I confess I don't understand why you torque them down to one figure then back off and re-torque to a lesser figure.
It takes a bit of churning over to start and billows white then blue smoke for 20/ 30 seconds before completely clearing but worryingly the oil level is increasing and smells of diesel.
I'm been a home mechanic for 40 years but diesels are fairly new to me so may have cocked up somewhere. Sad
Has anyone any ideas what went wrong ?
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eithan h
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 20:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

could be a bad injector, did you fool the manual regarding the procedure of fitting and tightening down? some people don't and tighten the rail down then tighten the injectors to the rail which bends them and pinch the seals. if you did follow the procedure then you either have a bad injector or a porous head or both.

did we speak about the serial no.s  i can't remember lol
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gascony
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Location: gers france

PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 18:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for prompt reply. I don't believe I tightened down incorrectly but I'll check , could have had a senior moment ! Confused
If it was a porous head presumably it would take some time to occur whereas this was pretty much straight away, so possible injector problem, can this be checked by a diesel repair shop,  what sort of cost is involved, are they repairable ?
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eithan h
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 21:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

the average repair shop won't be able to test them but there are some places that can rebuild them but they can't tell you what the new grade is. we can pressure test them to check for the leaking o ring and we charge about an hours labour to do it
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gascony
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Location: gers france

PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 8:51    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was thinking of a local dedicated diesel repair shop, i'll try them first as I would need to pay postage there and back to you from here in France
The o ring you mention is it within the injector then not the one on the outside ?
So if I understand, when it's rebuilt and regraded it wouldn't work without a software upgrade on the vehicle ?
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eithan h
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 17:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

correct about the o ring but the rebuilt ones will still work but the grade will/may have changed but because no one knows how isuzu grade them they can't tell you what the new grade would be they just say it's the same as before which it may be but theres also a good chance that due to small differences in machining of different parts it might have changed
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gascony
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Joined: 02 Dec 2016
Posts: 10
Location: gers france

PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

O rings look fine on injectors and I'm convinced I assembled as per manual anyway. so back to injectors, however having read on here about the part and code numbers
looking at mine i think i need some advice,  2 ' labels' are un readable .  1 has 897192596(1)? 0000 number unreadable,  last one has 8971925963 then 0000352499 then 51,
So if I read correctly these are pre any recall which it never had as it was lost in the system when it came out here.  Am I wasting my time with these getting them tested and
repaired ?  I'm beginning to think it might be a money pit !
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